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Date : 2014/09/14 04:46
User : saru
Edit Summary:
@@ -1,9 +1,9 @@
====== Balance project: ======
Whilst re-leveling my character, I have had an opportunity to consider what improvements could be made to the current combat system to make it more fun. Items, players and monster must all be balanced to be fun. It is not fun to be conquesting through a map with some challenge to, suddenly, unpredictably find yourself horribly underwpowered and dead. I am not refering to unique challenges and variety in maps such as special boss monsters or artifact items. In planned challenges the map designer is able to provide ample warning in game (or intential lack of warning), which can be a key element in making the game fun. Instead I am referring to the 'generic' monster or weapon from the archetype which have largely been created in an ad hoc fashion based on the needs of map designers. This has resulted in some items and monsters being out of step with player progression. Whilst it is simple to go and adjust each value at a time, at present there is little guidance on what it 'should' be.
===== General approach: =====
- I want to re-implement the balance of combat (spell, grace, melee and missile) and itemisation (closely linked to combat) by using a constant to measure against. This constant is likely to be player/monster/item level. This would mean that as a players level increases, the power of items increases and the difficulty of monsters increases such that the sum is approximately equal.
+ I want to re-implement the balance of combat (spell, grace, melee and missile) and itemisation (closely linked to combat) by using a constant to measure against. This constant is likely to be player/monster/item level. This would mean that as a players level increases, the power of items increases and the difficulty of monsters increases such that the sum is approximately equal. This means that all items and what maps they are accessed from and how hard the monsters are to kill there should be clearly linked!
This implies things like:
A spell user at level 10 should have as much power as a weapon user at level 10
@@ -26,107 +26,9 @@
* Clearer for players what sort of content matches their strength
* more intuitive for new players, particularly that information is more accessible during combat such as the effect of attacks on a monster
* Reduce the number of 'easy' ways to level
- ==== itemisation ====
- Currently items are split largely into 3 piles, general items, items with magical enhancement (+1, +2, of mostrai etc.), artifacts. Whilst this creates a large array of items to choose from, it is very difficult to know without a lot of pocking around, where a suitable level of balance for a new item is. e.g.
-
- ===armour===
- general body armour sits around +1 - +5 AC
- magical armour can get up to +9 AC
- artifact armour is generally around +5 AC
-
- By pulling out the .arcs the following table the general armour can be documented as:
- ^Name ^robe ^armour ^chain mail ^ring mail ^hauberk ^scale mail ^scale mail ^plate mail ^plate mail^
- |last_sp |12 |13 |10 |11 |10 |9 |9 |7 |7|
- |ac |1 |2 |4 |4 |4 |3 |3 |5 |5|
- |resist_physical |0 |10 |30 |20 |25 |10 |20 |40 |20|
- |weight |10000 |20000 |60000 |40000 |50000 |20000 |20000 |100000 |100000|
- |value |30 |40 |75 |85 |60 |8 |30 |100 |25|
- |gen_sp_armour |0 |8 |15 |15 |15 |10 |10 |30 |30|
-
- If we create an arbitrary formula to model how 'good' each item is it might look something like this:
-
- {{user:saru:image.png|}}
-
-
- we can see that the items appear to progress fairly linearly with the exception of one of the types of platemail which is clearly a lot worse. This item is the bronze variant of platemail listed last on the above table. One approach might be to move it back into line, however, items will all start to feel the same. Instead I intend on creating different 'tiers' of armour balanced on the level of the user. This would result in poorier quality items being readily available at low levels whilst much more powerful types of armour only available at higher levels. A formula for generating items out of treasure classes should be created. This would result in a table of general armour more like this:
-
- ^Armour group^ light - casters^ scales - thief^ Composite - barbarian^ full plate - warriors^
- ^leveling range 0-10^^^^^
- |Name |robe |leather scale mail |leather segmented armour |leather cuirass|
- |last_sp |20 |18 |17 |16|
- |materialname |cloth |leather |leather |leather|
- |ac |1 |2 |3 |4|
- |resist_physical |0 |10 |15 |20|
- |weight |1000 |2000 |3000 |3500|
- |value |10 |15 |20 |25|
- |gen_sp_armour |0 |5 |10 |15|
- ^level range: 10 - 20^^^^^
- |Name |lorica segmentata |ring mail |splint mail |plate mail|
- |last_sp |17 |16 |15 |14|
- |materialname |leather |iron |steel |steel|
- |ac |3 |4 |5 |6|
- |resist_physical |10 |20 |30 |30|
- |weight |8000 |15000 |15000 |18000|
- |value |30 |35 |40 |45|
- |gen_sp_armour |0 |10 |20 |30|
- ^level range: 20 - 40^^^^^
- |Name |breastplate |hauberk |brigandine |fluted mail|
- |last_sp |12 |10 |8 |6|
- |materialname |steel |steel |steel |steel|
- |ac |5 |6 |8 |10|
- |resist_physical |20 |25 |30 |50|
- |weight |10000 |14000 |15000 |25000|
- |value |50 |55 |60 |65|
- |gen_sp_armour |0 |15 |25 |40|
- ^level range: 40 - max ^^^^^
- |name |mithril splint|mithril chainmail |mithril coat of plates |mithril harness |
- |materialname |mithril |mithril |mithril |mithril |
- |ac |8 |10 |14 |18|
- |resist_physical |30 |40 |50 |60|
- |last_sp |21 |18 |15 |10|
- |weight |5000 |8000 |9000 |12000|
- |value |7000 |8000 |10000 |15000|
- |gen_sp_armour |0 |10 |20 |30|
- |item_power |1 |2 |3 |4|
-
- === Weapons ===
-
- Table comparing DPS of various common items in crossfire
- ^Item ^# of Hands^ Damage^ Weapon speed^ DPS at 10 Dex^ DPS at 20 Dex^ DPS at 30 Dex^
- |Nunchacu |2 |1 |4 |1.65 |2.2 |4.7|
- |Taifu |1 |2 |6 |3.1 |4.2 |9.2|
- |Dagger |1 |2 |5 |3.2 |4.3 |9.3|
- |Sting |1 |5 |6 |7.75 |10.5 |23|
- |Bearded Axe |1 |6 |9 |8.4 |11.7 |26.7|
- |Club |1 |6 |9 |8.4 |11.7 |26.7|
- |Hammer |1 |7 |9 |9.8 |13.65 |31.15|
- |Mace |1 |7 |9 |9.8 |13.65 |31.15|
- |Axe |1 |7 |10 |10.15 |14 |31.5|
- |Rapier |1 |7 |8 |10.15 |14 |31.5|
- |Katana |1 |7 |6 |10.85 |14.7 |32.2|
- |Sickle |1 |7 |4 |11.55 |15.4 |32.9|
- |Steel Longsword |1 |8 |8 |11.6 |16 |36|
- |Defender |1 |8 |8 |11.6 |16 |36|
- |Broad Sword |1 |9 |8 |13.05 |18 |40.5|
- |Firebrand |2 |9 |8 |13.05 |18 |40.5|
- |Morning star |1 |10 |11 |13 |18.5 |43.5|
- |Mjoellnir |2 |10 |8 |14.5 |20 |45|
- |Darkblade |1 |10 |7 |15 |20.5 |45.5|
- |Dragon Slayer |2 |11 |9 |15.4 |21.45 |48.95|
- |Trident |2 |11 |8 |15.95 |22 |49.5|
- |Long speed |2 |12 |9 |16.8 |23.4 |53.4|
- |Large morning star |2 |13 |12 |16.25 |23.4 |55.9|
- |Scythe |2 |14 |13 |16.8 |24.5 |59.5|
- |Gram |2 |18 |15 |19.8 |29.7 |74.7|
- |Poleaxe |2 |18 |12 |22.5 |32.4 |77.4|
- |Large club |2 |20 |17 |20 |31 |81|
- |Two handed sword |2 |18 |8 |26.1 |36 |81|
- |Skull cleaver |2 |20 |11 |26 |37 |87|
- |Lava Slasher |2 |30 |9 |42 |58.5 |133.5|
- |Firestar |2 |35 |9 |58.8 |78.05 |165.55|
- |Bone Crusher |2 |50 |15 |55 |82.5 |207.5|
+ The best starting point is where a new player starts:
====Character simplification====
===race===
as per [[user:mwedel:characters]].
@@ -234,17 +136,17 @@
Levitation - like meditation, this is given for certain races, but it never changes, so is really just an ability.
Use Magic Item - all races/classes can use magic items, so this really is not necessary. If one really wanted to put checks in the ability to use wands, then that check should be in the thaumaturgy skill. The only reason this skill really exists is that a skill bucket was needed to put exp gained by using wands, etc.
- ====Attack system simplification====
- ===combat general===
+ =====Attack system simplification=====
+ ====combat general====
AC and WC replaced with chance to dodge and chance to hit.
- ==dodge==
+ ===dodge===
As per [[user:mwedel:skills#dodge]]. I would also include a dodge bonus for level gaps which could be as simple as level of attacker/level of defender. E.g. a level 10 player fighting a level 20 monster might have 50% chance to hit + any additional dodge bonus the enemy has.
A bonus to chance to hit could also be added which counteracts dodging.
- ===Attack_types===
+ ====Attack_types====
Attack types should be able to constitute a fraction of an items damage. (e.g. if the Dam = 10, and physical is 1 and fire is .5 then the total damage should be 10 physical damage + 5 fire damage reduced by their respective resistances). This prevents attack_type stacking being too all or nothing where warriors either need every attack type (fire, cold, electrical) or don't care about attack types at all (weaponmagic)
Attack_types and their respective resistances should be entirely simplified to mwedel's plan here: [[user:mwedel:skills#resistances]]
@@ -267,4 +169,107 @@
|<del>Chaos</del> | Chaos | Randomized attack | This is really an administrative/effect - it is supposed to randomize for one of the other attacktypes, so characters should never be facing chaos itself. |
|<del>Counterspell</del> | Counterspell | Stops a spell effect | Once again, this is an effect, can get removed. |
Internal: This continues to exist, but should never be visible to players - this is really just used when a convenient way to do damage to the character is done (eg, ceiling collapsing, crushing you, character is dead) - it probably should be used sparingly.
+
+ ==== itemisation ====
+ Currently items are split largely into 3 piles, general items, items with magical enhancement (+1, +2, of mostrai etc.), artifacts. Whilst this creates a large array of items to choose from, it is very difficult to know without a lot of pocking around, where a suitable level of balance for a new item is. e.g.
+
+ ===armour===
+ general body armour sits around +1 - +5 AC
+ magical armour can get up to +9 AC
+ artifact armour is generally around +5 AC
+
+ By pulling out the .arcs the following table the general armour can be documented as:
+ ^Name ^robe ^armour ^chain mail ^ring mail ^hauberk ^scale mail ^scale mail ^plate mail ^plate mail^
+ |last_sp |12 |13 |10 |11 |10 |9 |9 |7 |7|
+ |ac |1 |2 |4 |4 |4 |3 |3 |5 |5|
+ |resist_physical |0 |10 |30 |20 |25 |10 |20 |40 |20|
+ |weight |10000 |20000 |60000 |40000 |50000 |20000 |20000 |100000 |100000|
+ |value |30 |40 |75 |85 |60 |8 |30 |100 |25|
+ |gen_sp_armour |0 |8 |15 |15 |15 |10 |10 |30 |30|
+
+ If we create an arbitrary formula to model how 'good' each item is it might look something like this:
+
+ {{user:saru:image.png|}}
+
+
+ we can see that the items appear to progress fairly linearly with the exception of one of the types of platemail which is clearly a lot worse. This item is the bronze variant of platemail listed last on the above table. One approach might be to move it back into line, however, items will all start to feel the same. Instead I intend on creating different 'tiers' of armour balanced on the level of the user. This would result in poorier quality items being readily available at low levels whilst much more powerful types of armour only available at higher levels. A formula for generating items out of treasure classes should be created. This would result in a table of general armour more like this:
+
+ ^Armour group^ light - casters^ scales - thief^ Composite - barbarian^ full plate - warriors^
+ ^leveling range 0-10^^^^^
+ |Name |robe |leather scale mail |leather segmented armour |leather cuirass|
+ |last_sp |20 |18 |17 |16|
+ |materialname |cloth |leather |leather |leather|
+ |ac |1 |2 |3 |4|
+ |resist_physical |0 |10 |15 |20|
+ |weight |1000 |2000 |3000 |3500|
+ |value |10 |15 |20 |25|
+ |gen_sp_armour |0 |5 |10 |15|
+ ^level range: 10 - 20^^^^^
+ |Name |lorica segmentata |ring mail |splint mail |plate mail|
+ |last_sp |17 |16 |15 |14|
+ |materialname |leather |iron |steel |steel|
+ |ac |3 |4 |5 |6|
+ |resist_physical |10 |20 |30 |30|
+ |weight |8000 |15000 |15000 |18000|
+ |value |30 |35 |40 |45|
+ |gen_sp_armour |0 |10 |20 |30|
+ ^level range: 20 - 40^^^^^
+ |Name |breastplate |hauberk |brigandine |fluted mail|
+ |last_sp |12 |10 |8 |6|
+ |materialname |steel |steel |steel |steel|
+ |ac |5 |6 |8 |10|
+ |resist_physical |20 |25 |30 |50|
+ |weight |10000 |14000 |15000 |25000|
+ |value |50 |55 |60 |65|
+ |gen_sp_armour |0 |15 |25 |40|
+ ^level range: 40 - max ^^^^^
+ |name |mithril splint|mithril chainmail |mithril coat of plates |mithril harness |
+ |materialname |mithril |mithril |mithril |mithril |
+ |ac |8 |10 |14 |18|
+ |resist_physical |30 |40 |50 |60|
+ |last_sp |21 |18 |15 |10|
+ |weight |5000 |8000 |9000 |12000|
+ |value |7000 |8000 |10000 |15000|
+ |gen_sp_armour |0 |10 |20 |30|
+ |item_power |1 |2 |3 |4|
+
+ === Weapons ===
+
+ Table comparing DPS of various common items in crossfire
+ ^Item ^# of Hands^ Damage^ Weapon speed^ DPS at 10 Dex^ DPS at 20 Dex^ DPS at 30 Dex^
+ |Nunchacu |2 |1 |4 |1.65 |2.2 |4.7|
+ |Taifu |1 |2 |6 |3.1 |4.2 |9.2|
+ |Dagger |1 |2 |5 |3.2 |4.3 |9.3|
+ |Sting |1 |5 |6 |7.75 |10.5 |23|
+ |Bearded Axe |1 |6 |9 |8.4 |11.7 |26.7|
+ |Club |1 |6 |9 |8.4 |11.7 |26.7|
+ |Hammer |1 |7 |9 |9.8 |13.65 |31.15|
+ |Mace |1 |7 |9 |9.8 |13.65 |31.15|
+ |Axe |1 |7 |10 |10.15 |14 |31.5|
+ |Rapier |1 |7 |8 |10.15 |14 |31.5|
+ |Katana |1 |7 |6 |10.85 |14.7 |32.2|
+ |Sickle |1 |7 |4 |11.55 |15.4 |32.9|
+ |Steel Longsword |1 |8 |8 |11.6 |16 |36|
+ |Defender |1 |8 |8 |11.6 |16 |36|
+ |Broad Sword |1 |9 |8 |13.05 |18 |40.5|
+ |Firebrand |2 |9 |8 |13.05 |18 |40.5|
+ |Morning star |1 |10 |11 |13 |18.5 |43.5|
+ |Mjoellnir |2 |10 |8 |14.5 |20 |45|
+ |Darkblade |1 |10 |7 |15 |20.5 |45.5|
+ |Dragon Slayer |2 |11 |9 |15.4 |21.45 |48.95|
+ |Trident |2 |11 |8 |15.95 |22 |49.5|
+ |Long speed |2 |12 |9 |16.8 |23.4 |53.4|
+ |Large morning star |2 |13 |12 |16.25 |23.4 |55.9|
+ |Scythe |2 |14 |13 |16.8 |24.5 |59.5|
+ |Gram |2 |18 |15 |19.8 |29.7 |74.7|
+ |Poleaxe |2 |18 |12 |22.5 |32.4 |77.4|
+ |Large club |2 |20 |17 |20 |31 |81|
+ |Two handed sword |2 |18 |8 |26.1 |36 |81|
+ |Skull cleaver |2 |20 |11 |26 |37 |87|
+ |Lava Slasher |2 |30 |9 |42 |58.5 |133.5|
+ |Firestar |2 |35 |9 |58.8 |78.05 |165.55|
+ |Bone Crusher |2 |50 |15 |55 |82.5 |207.5|
+
+
+
IP-Address : 59.167.121.117
Old Revision: http://wiki.metalforge.net/doku.php/user:saru:balance?rev=1410686300
New Revision: http://wiki.metalforge.net/doku.php/user:saru:balance
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