From nicolas.weeger at laposte.net Sat Jul 5 14:37:54 2014 From: nicolas.weeger at laposte.net (Nicolas Weeger) Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2014 21:37:54 +0200 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> Message-ID: <201407052138.02555.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> Hello. Finally had time to make a small POC of a mini-game related to lockpicking :) You can see it at http://nicolas.weeger.org/lp/index.html On the top, your picks. Bottom, the lock components to pick (left to right). Aim: use the picks in the correct order to pick the 5 lock components. Red square is currently selected pick. Arrows move selection (wrapping on limits). Space rotate (active pick is the right part). Enter uses on lock component. To make it easier to figure, on the bottom you have a number (how many components you picked), then 2 numbers, currently selected pick's value and next lock component's value, so just match them and hit enter :) Obvious improvements would be better graphism, and chance of breaking a pick if you use the wrong one! And of course removing the hints :D Would thid kind of minigame be fun for CF? Regards Nicolas Le jeudi 12 juin 2014 20:35:55, Nicolas Weeger a ?crit : > Hello. > > > I'd like to change various things in the game, to make it funnier (IMO) in > non combat aspects. So here are random proposals. > > > > What about "mini-games"? > > For instance, instead of a mere lockpicking, you actually have to use the > picks in the right order in a limited time to pick a lock - if you fail, > you trigger the traps, of course. > > [bonus points to who knows the old game I'm getting inspiration from :)] > > > > > > > What about changing alchemy (including the jeweler etc. variants)? > > For each formulae you start with a ~3% chance of success. You succeed? Get > 3 to 5 points. Failure? Get 0-1 point (failure is a valuable lesson, after > all > > :)). Capped to ~90%. And maybe not giving global experience. > > What about random (ie player-dependant) parameters? You have more success > during certain hours, or outside vs inside, or...? > > > > > Then reduce the dropped items. I mean, so much junk! > > > > > Then, slowing (a lot) combat, making it more tactical. Instead of a zillion > monsters, some hard to defeat monsters, where you can use all your skills > and items, and attempt various combinations. > > Then various effects on weapons: stun, knock back, confuse, slow, etc. > > Reduce the zillion elemental attacks to a lower number (6? 8?), other > things are side effects. > > > > > > > Thoughts? Flames? Ideas? > > > > Regard > > Nicolas -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 198 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From kevinz5000 at gmail.com Sun Jul 6 13:47:06 2014 From: kevinz5000 at gmail.com (Kevin Zheng) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2014 13:47:06 -0500 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <201407052138.02555.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <201407052138.02555.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> Message-ID: <53B999AA.8020302@gmail.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 07/05/2014 14:37, Nicolas Weeger wrote: > Finally had time to make a small POC of a mini-game related to > lockpicking :) > > On the top, your picks. Bottom, the lock components to pick (left > to right). It's difficult to tell where each section ends; in the final version it might be useful to highlight the current segment. > Aim: use the picks in the correct order to pick the 5 lock > components. Sounds reasonable. > Obvious improvements would be better graphism, and chance of > breaking a pick if you use the wrong one! And of course removing > the hints :D How would breaking a pick be represented in the game? Will there be a separate item for each pick depicted, or will breaking a pick cause the single lockpick item to be destroyed/damaged? > Would thid kind of minigame be fun for CF? Yes, if used sparingly. I would not want to go through this entire process when picking every single lock. But, this would make sense when picking an important lock. Thanks, Kevin Zheng -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJTuZmqAAoJEOrPD3bCLhCQ0sAH/3GdAJhDAtXg/ZZr1SRq9kOk 2TbnSPcdtJcaBEEVUVkwmhgY3YenBoEDUUFJ1lZAo7u+anV8oKvfsLYz89neb/10 sQYJgzMsbYxlPcsCupTpbuN7w5rTrmkpoT+ZiCBxIupRHkwauqAVI55h3pzCFRsh GajlKLimqpYvleYrIqCNyx9BneP4k/6Q2u3yFeKrOlpH3MgPw1BPx12MWkXCyXA5 imWdfTrCayvCOqwWsWfK80liz2WNxxJgUQ66SQd5/Ga0k1YR5kbqnCtqGq9QniA4 T4YKxY9fa5ASyZUfTgCdMNAM0d4xFvLlosrHpVs2C3ThETPyQdlpGRTi+AmFJns= =8JEC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From bloodyshade at gmail.com Sun Jul 6 13:57:23 2014 From: bloodyshade at gmail.com (Bloody Shade) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2014 15:57:23 -0300 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <53B999AA.8020302@gmail.com> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <201407052138.02555.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <53B999AA.8020302@gmail.com> Message-ID: <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> I also found it a bit hard to identify where each section ended, which made the minigame a little confusing in the beginning. I'm also worried about the frequency of this and other minigames that might arise from these changes, while they can be fun when used in very specific situations, otherwise they just compromise immersion by "forcing you out" of the main game focus. Much like how modern games are plagued by quick time events, which are anything but a good thing, and I'd hate to see crossfire fall to the same trap. On 7/6/2014 3:47 PM, Kevin Zheng wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > On 07/05/2014 14:37, Nicolas Weeger wrote: >> Finally had time to make a small POC of a mini-game related to >> lockpicking :) >> >> On the top, your picks. Bottom, the lock components to pick (left >> to right). > It's difficult to tell where each section ends; in the final version > it might be useful to highlight the current segment. > >> Aim: use the picks in the correct order to pick the 5 lock >> components. > Sounds reasonable. > >> Obvious improvements would be better graphism, and chance of >> breaking a pick if you use the wrong one! And of course removing >> the hints :D > How would breaking a pick be represented in the game? Will there be a > separate item for each pick depicted, or will breaking a pick cause > the single lockpick item to be destroyed/damaged? > >> Would thid kind of minigame be fun for CF? > Yes, if used sparingly. I would not want to go through this entire > process when picking every single lock. But, this would make sense > when picking an important lock. > > Thanks, > Kevin Zheng > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v2 > Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ > > iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJTuZmqAAoJEOrPD3bCLhCQ0sAH/3GdAJhDAtXg/ZZr1SRq9kOk > 2TbnSPcdtJcaBEEVUVkwmhgY3YenBoEDUUFJ1lZAo7u+anV8oKvfsLYz89neb/10 > sQYJgzMsbYxlPcsCupTpbuN7w5rTrmkpoT+ZiCBxIupRHkwauqAVI55h3pzCFRsh > GajlKLimqpYvleYrIqCNyx9BneP4k/6Q2u3yFeKrOlpH3MgPw1BPx12MWkXCyXA5 > imWdfTrCayvCOqwWsWfK80liz2WNxxJgUQ66SQd5/Ga0k1YR5kbqnCtqGq9QniA4 > T4YKxY9fa5ASyZUfTgCdMNAM0d4xFvLlosrHpVs2C3ThETPyQdlpGRTi+AmFJns= > =8JEC > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > _______________________________________________ > crossfire mailing list > crossfire at metalforge.org > http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire > --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active. http://www.avast.com From mwedel at sonic.net Mon Jul 7 01:16:39 2014 From: mwedel at sonic.net (Mark Wedel) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2014 23:16:39 -0700 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <201407052138.02555.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <53B999AA.8020302@gmail.com> <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> Message-ID: <53BA3B47.7000000@sonic.net> On 07/ 6/14 11:57 AM, Bloody Shade wrote: > I also found it a bit hard to identify where each section ended, which made the > minigame a little confusing in the beginning. > > I'm also worried about the frequency of this and other minigames that might > arise from these changes, while they can be fun when used in very specific > situations, otherwise they just compromise immersion by "forcing you out" of the > main game focus. > Much like how modern games are plagued by quick time events, which are anything > but a good thing, and I'd hate to see crossfire fall to the same trap. I know some other games have an idea of you can either play the minigame (at which point it is largely player skill and the character skill makes it easier), or a quick 'use character' skill type thing which is probably less prone to work, but also very fast (and in the case of failures, lockpicks break) From the initial description, it sounds like each pick has 2 ends, and the player also has to choose which end to use. I also wonder if that complication is worth it - each pick having a single end so no rotation is necessary would seem to keep the game the same, but make the interface/play simpler (an as an aside, it would seem like this type of thing would need some client support, and I could certainly see a client basically breaking apart the lockpick into its two halves, rotating one of them, and when the player clicks on one, determines which pick that is and if an orientation change is needed) Of course, with all that talk, I then wonder how long until someone makes a 'lockpicking plugin' for the client which just figures out everything on its own. Though that becomes more a player choice thing, as with enough plugins, the game can play itself. One other question - in the example you give, there are 5 components that need to be picked. Presuming lockpicks need to be found/bought, if the character is lacking one of the picks, are they just out of luck? From om at iki.fi Tue Jul 8 08:02:00 2014 From: om at iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2014 16:02:00 +0300 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <201407052138.02555.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <53B999AA.8020302@gmail.com> <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> Message-ID: <53BBEBC8.4010501@iki.fi> How do you envision the in-game lockpicking skill to change these minigames? It really should, shouldn't it? Also, even now, for higher-level characters it is still quite often easier to bash in a door than to stop to pick them (as you gain lockpicking skill levels really slowly). Adding fairly lengthy games like this will in their case just end up meaning more bashed doors... -- /* * * Otto J. Makela * * * * * * * * * */ /* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */ /* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */ /* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */ From nicolas.weeger at laposte.net Tue Jul 8 13:13:42 2014 From: nicolas.weeger at laposte.net (Nicolas Weeger) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 20:13:42 +0200 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <53B999AA.8020302@gmail.com> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <201407052138.02555.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <53B999AA.8020302@gmail.com> Message-ID: <201407082013.47090.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> > It's difficult to tell where each section ends; in the final version > it might be useful to highlight the current segment. Yes, or make the connecting part a different color ;) > How would breaking a pick be represented in the game? Will there be a > separate item for each pick depicted, or will breaking a pick cause > the single lockpick item to be destroyed/damaged? Break a pick, it's destroyed, probably. > Yes, if used sparingly. I would not want to go through this entire > process when picking every single lock. But, this would make sense > when picking an important lock. Or let the player choose whether to manually pick, or automatically pick (or bash :)). Regards Nicolas -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 198 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From nicolas.weeger at laposte.net Tue Jul 8 13:14:38 2014 From: nicolas.weeger at laposte.net (Nicolas Weeger) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 20:14:38 +0200 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <53B999AA.8020302@gmail.com> <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> Message-ID: <201407082014.38793.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> > I also found it a bit hard to identify where each section ended, which > made the minigame a little confusing in the beginning. It's a proof of concept, not a final product :) > I'm also worried about the frequency of this and other minigames that > might arise from these changes, while they can be fun when used in very > specific situations, otherwise they just compromise immersion by > "forcing you out" of the main game focus. Define "main game focus" :) > Much like how modern games are plagued by quick time events, which are > anything but a good thing, and I'd hate to see crossfire fall to the > same trap. It could be optional, on a per player basis. Regards Nicolas -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 198 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From nicolas.weeger at laposte.net Tue Jul 8 13:17:00 2014 From: nicolas.weeger at laposte.net (Nicolas Weeger) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 20:17:00 +0200 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <53BA3B47.7000000@sonic.net> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> <53BA3B47.7000000@sonic.net> Message-ID: <201407082017.01086.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> > I know some other games have an idea of you can either play the minigame > (at which point it is largely player skill and the character skill makes > it easier), or a quick 'use character' skill type thing which is probably > less prone to work, but also very fast (and in the case of failures, > lockpicks break) That's a solution, yes. > > From the initial description, it sounds like each pick has 2 ends, and > the player also has to choose which end to use. I also wonder if that > complication is worth it - each pick having a single end so no rotation is > necessary would seem to keep the game the same, but make the > interface/play simpler Maybe... The rotation is to make some more challenge, sometimes you need to figure where the right pick is ;) > (an as an aside, it would seem like this type of > thing would need some client support, Yup, quite possibly. > and I could certainly see a client > basically breaking apart the lockpick into its two halves, rotating one of > them, and when the player clicks on one, determines which pick that is and > if an orientation change is needed) > > Of course, with all that talk, I then wonder how long until someone makes > a 'lockpicking plugin' for the client which just figures out everything on > its own. Though that becomes more a player choice thing, as with enough > plugins, the game can play itself. Yes, see Zebulon. That part is totally out of concern for me - the game will probably be optional, so just skip it. > One other question - in the example you give, there are 5 components that > need to be picked. Presuming lockpicks need to be found/bought, if the > character is lacking one of the picks, are they just out of luck? I'd say most locks are regular components, and you have the corresponding picks. But special doors could have special components, so you need to find the right pick through eg a quest :) Regards Nicolas -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 198 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: From nicolas.weeger at laposte.net Tue Jul 8 13:17:57 2014 From: nicolas.weeger at laposte.net (Nicolas Weeger) Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 20:17:57 +0200 Subject: [crossfire] Game change proposals In-Reply-To: <53BBEBC8.4010501@iki.fi> References: <201406122036.00186.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> <53B99C13.1050704@gmail.com> <53BBEBC8.4010501@iki.fi> Message-ID: <201407082017.57735.nicolas.weeger@laposte.net> > How do you envision the in-game lockpicking skill to change these > minigames? It really should, shouldn't it? More time to pick the lock, less chance to break a pick when mistaking, probably? > Also, even now, for higher-level characters it is still quite often easier > to bash in a door than to stop to pick them (as you gain lockpicking skill > levels really slowly). Adding fairly lengthy games like this will in their > case just end up meaning more bashed doors... So the game could be optional :) Regards Nicolas -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 198 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: