[crossfire] Introducing item fatigue

Sun Nov 20 06:55:16 CST 2005

Le Dimanche 20 Novembre 2005 10:49, Nicolas Weeger a écrit :
>
      Hello.
     >

     >
      I'd like to discuss adding item weariness / fatigue.
     >
      Basically: each item has max fatigue points, which decrease at use (when
     >
      attacking for weapon, when attacked for shield, when player walks for
     >
      shoes, you get the idea)
     >
      Of course when fatigue reaches 0 the item breaks and is unusable or
     >
      simply disappears, and you have facilities to repair (maybe skills can
     >
      be used for that too).
     >
      Also fatigue reduces item bonus/attack/defense/... after some thresold
     >
      (<50% of total fatigue points?).
     >

     >
      Comments, opinions, critisicm? :)
     >

     >
      Ryo
     >

     I already made a similar fatigue proposal in the past on the forums, in a 
discussion related to alchemy. You'll find the copy of my own view of the 
topic ( 
     http://forum.metalforge.net/viewtopic.php?t=815&start=15
      )

For those too lazy to read, here is a summary of what I suggested.

Fatigue applied to objects:
--------------------------
- The existence of temporary fatigue (that wears off naturally) and permanent 
fatigue (items requiring repairs);

- Fatigue doesn't make items unusable, but make them more prone to fail/break, 
or less effective;

Fatigue applied to players/monsters:
-----------------------------------
- Every complex action generates an amount of fatigue proportional to its 
difficulty;

- There is no permanent fatigue for players/monsters;

- The fatigue value isn't clearly visible by the players, but only a hint of 
it is given ("You look tired", "You feel aware", etc);

- Fatigue increases the randomness of effects or their precision, rather than 
the chance of them to backfire on you in a nasty way;

- Some items could be used to restore fatigue more than HP/Food (ex: cup of 
coffee).

****
A long cut'n'paste being better than a short answer, here it what I initially 
wrote:

 Fatigue of the Cauldron 
 -----------------------
 A cauldron is made of metal. You put it on fire, throw ingredients that react 
sometimes very savagely inside and apply magical forces as well on it 
whenever you use one for alchemy. It thus sounds reasonable that it slowly 
degrades with use up to a point it isn't reliable anymore. I see this as a 
two-fold process: 

 - Temporary fatigue, caused for example by the cauldron becoming very hot. 
Those fatigue points would wear off after a given amount of time; 

 - Permanent fatigue which represents irreversible damages caused by 
alchemical processes on the cauldron. Those don't wear off, unless you get 
the cauldron to somebody able to repair it. 

 Fatigue by itself doesn't render the cauldron useless: it just increases the 
chances of it to be destroyed when cooking something in it, possibly with 
nasty effects (like sudden explosion). Note that this element could actually 
be used to offer a gradation in the prices: a cheap cauldron would be able to 
support only a limited amount of fatigue while a costly, luxury one would be 
able to endure much more. 

 It also introduces another way to spend money (repairing/replacing your 
cauldron), making the creation of easy-to-make objects less profitable 
commercially speaking. Note that since fatigue is completely independent of 
the difficulty of a given recipe, it is a convenient way to balance some 
overused recipes. And it is explainable by in-game ideas as well: Water of 
the Wise may be very easy to cast, but it may require a very high 
temperature, thus causing a lot of fatigue to the cauldron. 

 In my own idea, I'd say that an easy formula could cause a high amount of 
temporary fatigue, but little or no permanent one, thus harming only 
industrial alchemists. On the other hand, advanced alchemy could cause fewer 
temporary fatigue, but more permanent one, reflecting the difficulty of the 
process. 

 Codewise, I think this is pretty similar to the grace stat - it is spent each 
time you use it, it slowly recharges itself, but it needs some work to get it 
fully back. I'd simply make it not visible by default - at most, somebody 
with the smithery skill could attempt to evaluate the level of fatigue of a 
cauldron, or a spell may do it as well. Or why not asking Mostrai ? Smile 

 The important point to keep if this system ever becomes implemented is to 
make it general enough to be applied to other types of items and spells as 
well - There are other fields in which fatigue could possibly become an 
interesting addition in the future. Multiplying stats specific to a given 
skill isn't a good idea on the long run. 

 I'm also against of a arbitrary limited lifespan for cauldrons - if you want 
to buy it and keep it forever unused in your appartments, it is your right. I 
see no way to justify their auto-destruction after only a short delay. Their 
total lifespan should depend on what you do with them, so occasional 
alchemists don't get harmed in the process. 

 Finally, the question of a possible casting time came up; I'm basically 
against it, since a lot of legitimate players would probably find annoying to 
be forced to wait before casting again. Fatigue allows them to cast multiple 
times in a row - if they are ready to handle the risks involved. 

 Now, what about the 

 Alchemist's Fatigue 

 I'd say that it should basically work as the temporary fatigue I wrote about 
just before. It slowly recharges over time when doing nothing tiresome. Every 
complex action (casting a spell, or slashing monsters) should create fatigue. 
Caster's fatigue shouldn't increase the dangerousity level of the alchemical 
attempt, but instead its randomness: the more tired you are, the higher the 
chances of making an error in the process and thus the bigger the 
randomization of the results. 

 Caster's fatigue helps fighting the case of scripters using several cauldrons 
alternatively to "let them cool down" - the caster him/herself will have to 
"cool down" as well if he wants to still be able to make useful work. 

 This system has a kind of drawback, though: no longer you can safely play 
with alchemy whenever you want and especially after having emptied a couple 
of dungeons full of monsters. It forces you to planify your future actions. 
I'm not sure all players would easily agree with that. 

 As the Cauldron Fatigue, I think the value of this stat shouldn't be clearly 
visible to the player - at most, he/she should get an evaluation of it, 
possibly false under some circumstances (drinking alcohol, for example). Some 
items could help fighting fatigue (like the coffee cup), too. 

 So now, I ask to seasoned players their opinion about the fatigue idea: 
 - Do you think it is an acceptable solution ? 
 - If not, what are the possible issues you see ? 
 - If not, what is your own proposal to solve the problem ? 

 If players agree to spend a couple of minutes of their time to answer those, 
then the future system will probably be satisfying for most of them. 

 It is up to you now, as I've written enough for today Smile
--  
Yann Chachkoff
-----------------------
Garden Dwarf's Best Friend
-----------------------
GPG Key    : 
     http://keyserver.veridis.com:11371/export?id=9080288987474372064

Fingerprint: 6616 2E02 BAD2 4AEF C90A  F1EB 7E03 AAB9 844D 25E0
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 189 bytes
Desc: not available
Url : 
     http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/crossfire/attachments/20051120/55e02f50/attachment.pgp